great-lounge Saturday 9 October 2021
- If I hear one more person say that "DE is balanced because it is an endgame mod" or "default balance does not matter if you have configs" or "balance is moot since mc is a sandbox game" or "stuff must conform completely to vanilla's arstyle which consists of X, Y, and Z" I will commit legally questionable actions.That last one is less design related but it does make me seethe as @cr24 can confirm
- It’s interesting because the culture of mod packs for MC is so weird to me. Damn near impossible to design an experience that makes wide sweeping changes to the game that doesn’t delete a huge chunk of your potential audience in the process through incompatibility and other such shenanigansMod packs makes sense for creative but not so much for survival that’s kind of uhhh a video game
- Like let’s say for example you made a mod that changed ore distribution or something. What does that do to the gameplay of a mod that adds more oresOr overhauled the potion systemWhat happens to mods that include new potions for the vanilla systemCreating a mod with the expectation of it fitting into a mod pack is alien to me, coming from other modding communities
Replying tosunsetteCreating a mod with the expectation of it fitting into a mod pack is alien to me, coming…
I can imagine, especially coming from smash modding(edited)As far as my knowledge goes, smash modding is a "pick one" kind of dealA lot of the reason of why mc modding is modpack-centric, or perhaps more accurately, why it can even be that way to begin with has to do a lot with the nature of mods.- Which is... kind of odd, fabric in particular should logically make incompatibilities less common given how decentralized it isBut still, you can generally take any number of mods, drop them together, and they will work just fine, the main issue with this is not things working together but a question of balance, which is where modpacks kick inMods work together, but balancing so that they are also well integrated is a task that, while varying in difficulty, does very consistently require great experience and a good bit of patience, it is something only certain people enjoy doing, creating the whole modpack creator dynamic.It is in that manner a sort of a three-tiered community. Whereas most modding communities just have modders and players, here you have this sort of middleman that arranges things together
- the power creep thing in Minecraft modding is genuinely crazy to me I’ve never seen anything like it where you can say “here is a mod that adds a drill” and someone will go “why would I use this when I could use the turbo anal blaster 9000 and craft it for 3 dirt blocks” and then you have to buff the shit out of your drill to get people to use it in packs
Replying toAzzyypaarasIt is in that manner a sort of a three-tiered community. Whereas most modding…
Yeah modpacks in other games are almost always made by modders themselves because sticking a bunch of mods together can be fucking difficultReplying tosunsetteWhat happens to mods that include new potions for the vanilla system
Something I feel the need to note here is that the answer is... does it matter? Most mc mods are additive rather than transformative, they choose to add unto the game rather than change it directly. For the cases where a mod does change something important, it is generally on the dev to assure compat though data driving things has become rather common place, making this much easier and smootherReplying tosunsettethe power creep thing in Minecraft modding is genuinely crazy to me I’ve never seen…
I am not sure how well versed you are in the annals of modding history, but I will note that that state was not reached overnight, the power creep crisis that we are kind of getting out of was not the result of someone going "oh shit new mod, time to double the strength of all my machines so that people keep using mine" rather, it was just the result of years of innovation, trial and error, and cycling mod devs that slowly raised the stakesThis came to a peak around the 1.7 era where things just kind of... burstThings escalated slowly - very slowly, then a threshold was hit and it blew up- This burst of power creep engulfed 1.12, and now in 1.16 forge there seems to be a sort of unspoken battle, a war between the mod devs that want to keep the status quo and the ones that want to undo the power creepFabric is mostly free of that, as most of our mod devs are players that recently became mod devs, these are people jaded by the power creep, made men by the power creep, people who fear the power creep. What few mod devs did come over are not keen on making things opSo, no problems here so far
Replying tosunsettethis stuff is like expansive lore wtf
Well, mc has existed for what... 12, 13 years now if you count the pre-release versions? modding has been going on for most of that timeReplying tosunsetteThe question I guess I was initially positing was, does the prevalence of modpacks…
Just to not let this be lost to the discussion, what exactly do you mean by transformative works here?Replying tosunsetteits fun to watch devs of mods try to explain game design to people
the funniest thing is of all the people I've ever witnessed, for some reason modded mc players all think they're experts on game design- This is a pretty good reminder that modders, however mighty they may seem with their works, are still people and are liable to have shit takessomething something techreborn abandoning dusts in favor of raw ore
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